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  • Ultimate is slow, buggy, crashed

    I know I'll get dumped on, so dump away.

    I've been an ACD user for over 10 years, maybe 15. I've always liked ACD because it was quick, did the right things without bother, had good results.
    But then it started crashing, around 6 or 7 or so. I left feedback, and often was given a new, corrected version. Sometimes that helped, mostly not.

    I upgraded to the Ultimate package, but I'm not really sure why. I guess I didn't want to be left behind. It now takes maybe 3-4 minutes to be able to edit a photo, even for a simple crop. Photoshop is much quicker. That's if ACD doesn't crash, which it often does. I'm not at all surprised to see the little blue circle for several minutes, before I finally quit with Task Manager.

    My computer is a Surface Book 4, running the latest version of W10. I have plenty of drive storage, and cannot upgrade RAM, because RAM cannot be increased in a Surface Book.

    Me, pissed off.

  • #2
    Clark711, Not dumping... Just trying to help...

    The SurfacePro4 is a nice box. I wish I had one. But at 4G RAM, two cores, and no GPU, I am not sure I would use it for photo editing.

    I can't speak for PS... so I am not going to go there. And although that I don't have the same issues, I certainly respect you absolutely do and they would be very frustrating!

    In case it could help, from my system, I can almost tell by system performance when ACDSee is going to push out it's monthly reminder to run the database maintenance. It certainly seems like database integrity is directly related to operational speed (The database has been one of my major concerns for the last few revisions. The reliance on the Windows registry also rives me crazy from a programmatic point of view.)

    ​It may be worth trying a database optimization including clearing out orphaned files and the like. I doubt this will fully solve the issues, but maybe it makes crashing "less worse" as the disk swapping starts competing with database calls.

    ​Again, not dumping, just trying to help a bad situation... less bad.

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    • #3
      I'm running a 7th Generation Core i7 with an NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX 1050 (4GB GDDR5) and it still takes several seconds (up to 15) to open a small image. I think it has to do with the program wanting to phone home constantly.

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      • #4
        For another reference

        Laptop: i7-6700, GTX960M (2GB video RAM),
        ​Software: Ultimate 2018

        ​Open files in View, Develop or Edit modes
        25MB RAW: Less than 2 seconds
        ​120MB .acdc: Less than 2 seconds
        ​135MB TIF: Less than 2 seconds

        I think my local NVMe drive may have something to do with the sub 2 second speeds...
        This being said, I can't get over 5 seconds (typically in the 3 second range) when loading the same size files from a NAS with magnetic disks over the WiFi network .

        ​From this experience, I would not expect anything close to a 15 seconds to open a file with a i7 / GTX1050 combo.
        ​To get somethings near 15 seconds, something definitely seems strange.


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        • #5
          Gus, have you blocked all their spyware (inTouch, etc)?

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          • #6
            I blocked InTouch with previous version as I did have random pauses... I tried both with and without intouch in the 2018 release and do not notice a difference in performance. As it is now, my system has intouch, etc turned on..

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            • #7
              I'm having similar performance issues. I have an i7 6700k Intel, asus strix 1070 8gb, 16gb ddr 4 ram, acdsee database on separate ssd and photos on wd black drive. Yes it's pretty fast most of the time. It been crashing quite a lot when developing, using brushes etc. It then takes a couple minutes to reload. I haven't optimized the database yet and will be my next step but surely that can't be the entire problem. I also do work on affinity photo and don't have these issues but different software.

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              • #8
                I would agree that database optimization may or may not help... I know it can't hurt... and at least in my system, it is required to keep the things going smoothly.

                With regards to the database storage and picture storage location, is the separate SSD internal (SATA, PCIe, SCSI) or external (USB) or Network (NAS)?

                ​The reason why I ask is not speed of transfer... but relative to reports that others have done relative to the number of calls that may be made. Lots of small calls to a storage system that has longer write latencies due to communication protocols or basic hardware implementations can result in significant pauses in application operation.

                For the --database-- location.... I would think an internal SSD is OK. but some type of remote storage like a USB or NAS may contribute to issues.
                ​For the --file-- location, I don't think the drive attach method matters too much.

                A bit of experience from a personal test....
                ​I tried to keep my database on my network drive (NAS) once to take advantage of my backup system. I thought that since the files came across fast, it would not matter if the database was remote. I used and developed many applications that use a remote database or remote database files. In the end, I found this to be a horrible decision! In this case, the ACDSeee application slowed to a crawl and I saw frequent crashes. In the end, it seemed like the ACDSee --database-- operation was not suitable to work over a wireless networked environment. I attributed it to data reties, but the truth is I never found out for certain. The database was moved back to the local drive within a week and the problem went away.

                ​There is also a piece of me that wants to suggest the database should be kept on the same drive as the Windows registry. But I have no proof to support that recommendation. My other major complaint is about the use of the Windows registry as part of the main workflows in the acdc application which is just plain bad practice... but that is a longer story.

                ​The sad thing is that I know it is possible to get rid of these issues as a part of the application design. Unfortunately, if the issue is related to the database (my belief), then it is also interesting to know replacing the database or redoing the database schema is a HUGE undertaking. If would take a good team of programmer 12+ months to replace that major part of the application.I

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                • #9
                  I have completely deleted every trace of a database and it still take several seconds to open an image. My PC is brand new and top end (fastest SSD and Video card currently available).

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                  • #10
                    This really stinks. I am not sure how to get to the bottom of the problem 15 seconds to load a file. There must be a strange interaction somewhere that I have not bumped up against.

                    ​Physics are the same. Software is the same (Ult 2018, WIn10)... Hardware seems reasonable. Files are located locally. What else can it be that takes a file 15 seconds to load?

                    ​By chance, do you have multiple copies (different versions?)of AC installed on the same machine?

                    Maybe these could help provide a clue...
                    ​* Can you look at the task manager and see what is taking up resources when you open a file?
                    * ​In Manage Mode, dble click on a random file... when it opens in View Mode... what does the "file load time" in the bottom center of the screen say?




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                    • #11
                      The lag is the time it takes the entire program to open (longer than Photoshop). Once it's opened the image displays almost instantly. My workaround is to use Quickview - which is instant and would be perfectly fine if it respected the main viewer settings (for example: delete without asking, fit to image enlarge) and had a more complete context menu.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Klause Kunnenunt View Post
                        I have completely deleted every trace of a database and it still take several seconds to open an image. My PC is brand new and top end (fastest SSD and Video card currently available).
                        So you have a Samsung m.2 ssd. The 1050 isn't the fastest far from it actually.

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                        • #13
                          When I read the statement "and it still takes several seconds (up to 15) to open a small image" from the 11.29.2017 post, I took that to mean opening the file from within ACDSee.
                          ​So... Now getting more of the facts.... I tried Quick View (which I have never used before)... again under 3 seconds to view the file.... Next I transitioned into either Edit or Develop modes from QuickView. It is hard to say, maybe about 3 seconds for a 150MB image. (Again over a network)

                          ​I am not sure how to get to 15 seconds in any scenario unless I start changing out the hardware... and definitely no way to get to 3 minutes per the original post.

                          ​Pro tip: Even the fasted SSD drive is limited by the bus it is connected and the protocol in play. Thus, connecting SSDs to a SATA drive, may finally saturate SATA driver performance, but it will be much less than the actual performance capable listed in an SSD specification.

                          ​Using those m.2 SSDs as Nxdibbles suggests will get you to PCIe speeds (16GB/ss) which is well beyond the SATA options of 3GB/s or 6GB/s. However, even if there is only a 3G/s link, that would be potentially be much faster than my wireless network speed... So something still does not make sense.

                          I would still recommend going back and looking at the processes that are getting CPU cycles and RAM. I would not be surprised if there is some background process that is messing things up. (Some antivirus programs are notoriously horrible in this regard.)

                          ​You also mentioned your use of CCleaner in another post. June of 2017, the news mentions a malware hack was installed into CCleaner. Thus, you may also want to check for malware.

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                          • #14
                            Forget about my hardware, it's more than sufficient.

                            This is nothing to do with opening an image. It's how long it takes to load the entire application, before an image will appear. If the application is already open, then it's as good as instant. This wasn't the case with builds before Ultimate 11. If you clicked on an image, it would come up within a second. Now it's slower to load than Photoshop CC 2018.

                            I presume it's because of all the extra online junk they've bundled. I've tried to block all that, but it doesn't make any difference.

                            I've tried uninstalling, clearing the registry, reverting to the previous build, etc, but it's the same. I might go back to Ultimate 10, if I can be bothered.

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                            • #15

                              Klause,
                              Consider, using the data/insight from the process logs and running process monitors to determine the root cause.


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