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  • Problem: Orphaned database information. Duplicates showing when using catalog

    Thanks in advance for any help.
    Background info. Using ACDSee photo studio standard 2018. Windows 10. For organizing all my digital scrapbook supplies.
    For the last 2 years I have just used my laptop. Have embedded and database backup to a USB Drive on a regular basis. In May I decided it was time to get a 2TB EHD. I did not totally understand how to sync, file history, etc. So I copied my DIGIKIT folder from my C drive and Pasted into E: on the EHD. I did that several different times. (Don't remember if I did them all while in ACDSee or not). I think I deleted one of the older pasted DIGIKIT folders from the EHD; figuring I didn't need 3 or 5 backups. Noticed that when I used to search in the catalog there would be some duplicates but didn't think a whole lot about, didn't use it over the summer.

    Now if I am NOT connected to the EHD and I open the catalog Pane>click on a catalog item (example hearts) in the viewing pane not, all but many of the hearts are duplicated. in Properties-File Location of the duplicate is listed as <unmounted [6]>\DIGIKITS copied 05-29-21\(followed by location of original). If I click on View I get an Insert Volume error.
    If I AM connected to the EHD the location is listed as E:\DIGIKITS copied 05-29-21\ and then click on View I get Item not found error "ACDSee Photo studio could not locate the following file on your system EIGIKITS copied 05-29-21\DIGIKITS\Designer...... This item may have been moved or deleted outside of ACDSee Photo Studio, resulting in orphaned database information. Would you like to remove the database information for this item? Yes No If I click yes it deletes the duplicate file showing in the center panel and all is fine.

    1. Would the reason for this be because I deleted the backup folder from the EHD? If I delete a backed up folder from the EHD do I have to do it while working in ACDSee?

    2. I Checked my EHD for a folder dated 05-29-21 and there is not one there. I also checked my trash bin to see if it was there, but I had emptied the trash back in September.

    3. Am I correct that I need to individually delete each duplicate/orphaned database item, or is there a way to use Tools or view/sort/group/select/tag the duplicate items to delete as a group?

    Thanks Much,
    DebraB





  • #2
    DebraB

    I hope I am understanding your post correctly.

    If you copied the DIGIKIT folder from C: Drive to the external hard drive outside of ACDSee, (for example using Windows File Explorer) then the ACDsee database would not contain any entries that related to the "DIGIKIT" images on the external hard drive, and without database entries, the files are no longer being managed by ACDSee. In order for ACDSee to use keywords or whatever metadata you are embedding in the images, you would need to "Catalog" the images to recreate database entries for them.

    If you copied the DIGIKIT folder from C: Drive to the external hard drive using ACDSee, then ACDSee would have database entries relating to those files on the external hard drive, BUT if you subsequently deleted that particular "backup" copy from the external hard drive using for instance Windows File Explorer, then all those entries in the database would become orphans.

    If you don't have the external drive connected then you may still see the thumbnail for a file ACDSee thinks was on it from the database entry, but you obviously can't access that file if the drive isn't connected.

    If that particular database entry is actually an orphan, then you wouldn't be able to access it even if the external hard drive was connected, because the file itself is no longer there.

    The question as I see it, is whether you would ever need working access to the individual files on the external hard drive from ACDSee. From your post my understanding is those files are simply backups for the files on your C: drive, you may only ever need to use them if something happens to the files on the PC, and you would then restore (copy them back onto the PC from the backup. If that is the case then you don't need the database entries for the backup files, and you could avoid the orphan and duplicates issue by doing the backup of the DIGIKIT folder to the external drive, and any subsequent restore from outside of ACDSee.

    If that is indeed the case, another option (once you get rid of the orphans) is to mark that external hard drive as "Excluded". You can then copy to it, and read from it in ACDSee, but ACDSee will not maintain any database records for the files on it.
    Last edited by Greyfox; 11-16-2021, 05:34 AM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Greyfox,
      Yes you understood my situation correctly!

      I Did do "If you copied the DIGIKIT folder from C: Drive to the external hard drive using ACDSee, then ACDSee would have database entries relating to those files on the external hard drive, BUT if you subsequently deleted that particular "backup" copy from the external hard drive using for instance Windows File Explorer, then all those entries in the database would become orphans."

      What I have done with a small subcategory of the catalog to test on getting rid of the orphans is : Bring up (highlight the category to bring in the center viewing pane. Through a couple of sort>group>tag> operations I can select ALL the items(pictures) that ARE orphaned >Category>click the category and get the message box You are attempting to unassign the selected items. Do you wish to proceed? Click yes and I have deleted orphan/database from those items.

      Before I continue with doing this throughout the catalog is this what you would recommend or should I be doing something else to get rid of the orphans? (Data Maintenance??)

      Thank you,
      DebraB
      Last edited by DebraB; 11-16-2021, 07:18 AM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by DebraB View Post
        ..
        Before I continue with doing this throughout the catalog is this what you would recommend or should I be doing something else to get rid of the orphans? (Data Maintenance??)
        There are a couple of options. If I recall correctly the Database Maintenance in versions before 2021 was appallingly slow and in my experience prone to crashing. In the later 2021 and 2022 versions it works well.

        You could try Tools>Database>Optimize Database which should remove the orphans.

        My preferred option though, as long as you have embedded the metadata (keywords etc) in the images in the DIGIKIT folder on the PC, would be to leave the current database as it is for the moment.

        Open a completely new database and Tools>Database>Catalog all the files in your DIGIKIT folder into the new database. Providing you tick the appropriate boxes, the Catalog process will read the embedded metadata from the images into the new database. In my view that is the cleanest option as it does not have to contend with any problems that exist in the current database. It is also arguably the safest option, as you can still switch back to the old database if for some reason you aren't happy with the result.

        When you are satisfied that the new database is working as you want it, you can delete the old database.

        Incidentally in addition to backing up your DIGIKIT files, you should also be regularly backing up the ACDSee database itself (Tools>Database>Backup Database.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Greyfox View Post

          Open a completely new database and Tools>Database>Catalog all the files in your DIGIKIT folder into the new database. Providing you tick the appropriate boxes, the Catalog process will read the embedded metadata from the images into the new database. In my view that is the cleanest option as it does not have to contend with any problems that exist in the current database. It is also arguably the safest option, as you can still switch back to the old database if for some reason you aren't happy with the result.
          I have opened a new database. When I do Tools>Database>Catalog all the files The photo included is what my screen looks like....these are the boxes that were automatically ticked. Is this correct???
          Do I assume correctly that it will generate the top Categorie "DIGIKITS" in the Catalog and all it's subcategories that I had previously?(right now the Catalog lists Albums, People, Places, Various as Categories.

          And as to regularly backing up the ACDSee database itself; that I can say I have regularly done. Pretty much in the habit of embedding, and then doing backup.
          Thank you


          Comment


          • #6
            DebraB

            Yes, the boxes ticked in the screen view you posted should do the job.

            I haven't any personal experience with the 2018 Home version in terms of the re-build of Categories from the embedded ACDSee metadata, but the U2021 and U2022 version certainly does it OK, and the 2018 Home version manual says ".The safest way to retrieve all the ACDSee Metadata, (including categories and keywords), is to click Tools |Database | Catalog Files."

            If there are subfolders in your DIGIKIT folder, you could just Catalog a few to check whether it is giving you what you want, but otherwise just Catalog the whole DIGIKIT folder and see what the result is. The process is non destructive. You will still have your original database to fall back on, so nothing to lose giving it a try other than perhaps some time.

            Comment


            • #7
              Thank you for your help. I have it running, may take awhile. Question for when I get this done so I don't create the same mess.

              A. Do I need to now set my EHD as excluded. If so, where/how?
              B. How often do I need to optimize?
              C. Anything else that should be a 'must' to do?

              My workflow has been.
              I buy (or get freebies) a "digital scrapkit" folder with say 60 elements in it.
              1. I download it into my DIGIKITS/downloads while in ACDSee
              2. organize each item by putting it (categorizing it into its particular categorie (example paper, hearts, flowers, color, etc)
              3. THEN I move the original 'digital scrapkit' from DIGIKITS/download to DIGIKITS/designer name
              4. Embed metadata and then do database backup to a thumb drive.
              This has all been done in ACDSee.

              MY concern for doing backup to EHD is because of failure...meaning when laptop dies and I need to buy another computer I want to be able to upload my DIGIKITS to the new computer.

              So if I am NOT in ACDSee I can copy and Paste from WIndows 10/file explorer C:\Users\Deb\DIGIKITS to the EHD and date it. If I do that once a month, after a couple of months I could delete the oldest version. or is there a cleaner way. SO.....when my laptop does die/or i get a new one. I would use my EHD backup copy to upload my DIGIKITS folder.
              How would I get ACDSee back on the new computer? I would have the metadata on the thumb drive?

              Comment


              • #8
                Greyfox,

                ACDSee was running and cataloging the complete DIGIKIT folder. ACDSee closed partway through. Reopened ACDSee and has cataloged 5,951 items. (I would estimate there will be at least 60,000???)
                In the previews subcategory there are 20 showing and there should probably be around 60.
                It has been cataloging files into other subfolders also, but again not complete.
                Can I just do another Tools>Database>Catalog files and it will pick up where it left off??

                Deb
                Last edited by DebraB; 11-16-2021, 09:21 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by DebraB View Post
                  Greyfox,

                  ACDSee was running and cataloging the complete DIGIKIT folder. ACDSee closed partway through. Reopened ACDSee and has cataloged 5,951 items. (I would estimate there will be at least 60,000???)
                  In the previews subcategory there are 20 showing and there should probably be around 60.
                  It has been cataloging files into other subfolders also, but again not complete.
                  Can I just do another Tools>Database>Catalog files and it will pick up where it left off??
                  You could just start the Catalog process again. It won't pickup where it left off, it will simply overwrite any entries it has made, and then continue on with with the rest.

                  Unfortunately though, it may fail again. If is is not an issue of some other process happening on your laptop that has interrupted the Catalog process, it may well be there is a problem with one (or more) of the files ACDSee is trying to Catalog that it can't handle, and if that is the case it may fail when it gets to that file or files again.

                  Unfortunately if that is the case there isn't a really easy solution to this, except to break up the Catalog task into smaller pieces. It's a matter of breaking up the 60,000 files into smaller groups. If your DIGIKIT folder has sub-folders then you could perhaps Catalog the sub-folders separately. The aim is to narrow down which file or files is the cause of the failure.

                  If there are no sub-folder under the DIGIKIT folder, then it is a somewhat more difficult task. It will be a matter of copying (using Windows File Explorer) groups of files from your DIGIKIT folder into a group of temporary new folders, for instance DK_01, DK_02, DK_03 etc, and then individually Cataloging those folders in ACDSee. If any fail, make a note of which folder it is, then untick or remove that folder in the Catalog dialog. Any that have completed successfully can then also be un-ticked so they are not re-done on the next run. When you have Cataloged all of the files that you can, you can go back to the (hopefully only one temporary folder) that failed and break it down into smaller groups.....

                  In the end you will hopefully have a whole lot of these temporary folders showing the ACDSee folder tree, at that point using ACDSee you can create a new DIGIKIT folder, then select each of the temporary folders in turn, do a Ctrl + A to select all of the items in it and move them into the new DIGIKIT folder. When they have all been moved into the new folder, then using ADCSee you can delete all the empty temporary folders. The aim is eventually to have all of the files from the OLD_DIGIKIT folder, with the exception of any that have been found to not be able to be Cataloged, and when this has been achieved you can then delete the old DIGIKIT folder.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Greyfox.
                    I completed the new database and everything seems to be working as it should. Will give it a couple days before I delete the old one.
                    Did create a metadata backup unto my thumb drive.

                    Thank you for all your help.
                    Anything else you see I should make sure I do on a regular basis? optimize, should I be doing database maintenance?

                    With going through all the folders I see a lot of getting rid of files that I will never use. As long as I move or delete them while working in ACDSee I should be just frine, correct?
                    Deb

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      DebraB

                      Good to hear it is all now working.

                      Did create a metadata backup unto my thumb drive
                      If you mean you used Tools/Database/.Backup Database to put a database backup on a thumb drive, then that is OK, but you could just as well put that into a "Database backup" folder on your external hard drive. The database backups are zip files containing a compressed copy of the database itself. When making them, I personally DON'T include thumbnails as that both keeps the size down and significantly reduces the time it takes to make the backup.

                      Anything else you see I should make sure I do on a regular basis? optimize, should I be doing database maintenance?
                      You can get an idea of how many orphan files and folders there are at any time by going to the Dashboard, and then selecting the database tab. If there are only a few orphans then I personally wouldn't get concerned, but if there are many, its best to do an optimize.
                      .
                      I personally recommend running Tools/Database/Database Optimize on a regular basis to keep the database as efficient as possible.
                      Beyond that the normal PC house keeping, Windows updates kept current, drivers, particularly graphics drivers kept current etc.
                      If the internal drive is a mechanical rotating hard drive, then perhaps the occasional defragment, but I wouldn't over do that.

                      Having a relatively current backup of your data files (in this case your DIGIKIT folder) on an external hard drive is good, but keep in mind that external hard drives can be even more susceptible to failure than their in PC counterparts. (An accidental drop can be absolutely fatal), so if you can afford it, a good policy is to have two external drives and backup to each one alternatively. For instance if you backup weekly, then one week you would backup to external drive A, the next week to drive B. That way if there is a problem with one backup, there is still another you can turn too.

                      With going through all the folders I see a lot of getting rid of files that I will never use. As long as I move or delete them while working in ACDSee I should be just fine, correct?
                      Correct. When files and folders are being actively managed by ACDSee, then all copy, move and delete operations on those files are best done using ACDSee so it can keep its database relevant.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Greyfox View Post
                        [USER="25483"]DebraB[/USER

                        Having a relatively current backup of your data files (in this case your DIGIKIT folder) on an external hard drive is good, but keep in mind that external hard drives can be even more susceptible to failure than their in PC counterparts.
                        Doing the backup to external hardrive is where I got everything messed up to begin with. Is this what I should be doing?

                        Using Windows 10
                        To correctly do a backup of my DIGIKIT folder to an external hard drive (E).
                        1. DO NOT do from ACDSee (even have ACDSee closed so I don't mess up).
                        2. On my hard drive (C) windows file explorer navigate to DIGIKIT FOLDER
                        3. Right click to highlight C: Users>Deb>DIGIKITS
                        4. click on Copy
                        5. go to external hard drive E:
                        6. Paste

                        During the month working in ACDsee I do changes, delete, add, categorize in my DIGIKIT folder. At the end of the month.,Close ACDSee and work in file explorer and just repeat steps 1-6.
                        A. Do I Paste it to E DIGIKIT folder or do I create a new folder to Paste to (example) E DGIKIT 2021-12-01 and when I need more space then delete earlier versions?

                        B. Right now my External Hard drive has several different DIGIKIT folders (E DIGIKIT 11-24-21 E DIGIKITS E DIGIKITS copied 5-23-21.......along with PHOTOS, File History, Documents)
                        I am NOT SURE if I did them through ACDSee or Windows file explorer. To CLEAN UP the External Hard drive should I Delete all the current DIGIKIT folders and Then do a brand new backup of the DIGIKIT Folder?

                        Thanks,


                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by DebraB View Post
                          Doing the backup to external hardrive is where I got everything messed up to begin with. Is this what I should be doing?
                          There are two different backups in play here.

                          (1) the backups of your DIGIKIT Files from your portable to your external hard drive
                          (2) the backups of the ACDSee database itself to where ever you want to keep them.

                          Backup type (1)
                          I'm assuming that before you make each backup of the DIGIKIT files, you have completed assigning your categories, Keywords etc to any new items, and have embedded that metadata in the items. Tools/Metadata//Embed ACDSee Metadata

                          Since you don't want the backup file sets of the DIGIKIT files in the external hard drive to appear in the ACDSee database, then yes, do as you outlined, copy the DIGIKIT folder on your PC to the external hard drive using Windows File Explorer.

                          If you "exclude" the external hard drive in ACDSee (From manage mode, Tools/Database/Excluded Folder Settings) then you can still use the Windows File Explorer method, but even if you do copy a file to that external drive from within ACDSee no entry for that file will be added into the database.

                          My recommendation would be NOT to overwrite the previous backup DIGIKIT file on the external hard drive, and to keep the at least two versions, so rename each backup after copying to the external hard drive as you mentions ((eg: EIGIKIT_2021-12-01)

                          Backup type (2)
                          This is the backup of the ACDSee database itself, and is done from Tools/Database/Backup Database.
                          You have the option in the Backup Wizard to either "Create a new backup" or "Update an existing backup"
                          My recommendation would be to always choose "Create a new backup".
                          In the next wizard dialog choose "Do not include thumbnails" and leave the "Backup files of type un-ticked.
                          In the third wizard dialog you can choose where to place the backup file.
                          You can specify a USB thumb or flash drive, but my recommendation would be to have those backup files placed in a folder on your external hard drive, for example E:ACDSeeBK.
                          ACDSee will individually date stamp each backup, so you can keep a number of the backups.

                          Thumb drives are easily misplaced, external hard drives not so much so, hence the recommendation.

                          I am NOT SURE if I did them through ACDSee or Windows file explorer. To CLEAN UP the External Hard drive should I Delete all the current DIGIKIT folders and Then do a brand new backup of the DIGIKIT Folder?
                          Regardless of how you did them, when you created a complete new database, and Cataloged only the images from PC into it, the database at that stage had no entries relating to the files on your external hard drive, and regardless of how the backups were originally done, the files on your external hard drive are only copies of those on your PC, so you don't need to do anything with them other than to delete the oldest one each time you've added a new one.

                          It is important to realize that if you have not excluded the external drive from within ACDSee, then if you browse or look at any of the files on it with ACDSee, database entries will be created for those folders and files. If you haven't already done so, you should "exclude" that drive. Tools/Options/Database/Excluded Folders. Once that is done, you can browse it from ACDSee without adding database entries for the items on it.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Greyfox View Post
                            It is important to realize that if you have not excluded the external drive from within ACDSee, then if you browse or look at any of the files on it with ACDSee, database entries will be created for those folders and files. If you haven't already done so, you should "exclude" that drive. Tools/Options/Database/Excluded Folders. Once that is done, you can browse it from ACDSee without adding database entries for the items on it.
                            1. I have gone Tools/Options/Database then it gives me a place to manage excluded folders. I can browse to C: and D: and then it has folder icon and states Removable Disk.
                            Since I do not have the EHD connected would it be correct to click on the Removable Disk ?

                            2. But even before that screen, on the excluded folders screen there is a checked box in lower left corner that is ticked Always exclude removable drives ​​​. Does this mean the External hard drive is already excluded? I have not done any final 'add to list' yet.

                            photos are of how the screens appear.


                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by DebraB View Post

                              1. I have gone Tools/Options/Database then it gives me a place to manage excluded folders. I can browse to C: and D: and then it has folder icon and states Removable Disk.
                              Since I do not have the EHD connected would it be correct to click on the Removable Disk ?
                              No, you need to have your external USB hard drive connected and powered up before you click on the Add button.
                              Going on previous posts it should show up as drive E:

                              I'm not sure what that is that is currently showing as "Removable"

                              2. But even before that screen, on the excluded folders screen there is a checked box in lower left corner that is ticked Always exclude removable drives ​​​. Does this mean the External hard drive is already excluded? I have not done any final 'add to list' yet.
                              This can be a bit confusing. Removable drives include drives that have removable media, so diskette drives, CD, DVD, Blu-Ray drives etc.
                              It also includes most thumb (flash drives), but not all - flash drives made by SanDisk for a relatively short period starting about mid 2013 identified as non removable.

                              External USB hard drives are NOT classed as removable

                              I personally would leave the "always exclude removable drives" ticked, but you need to specifically add your external USB hard drive:to the list to exclude it.

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